Kevin Kresse
Sculptor
This week we revisit Kerry's two prior interviews with Arkansan painter and sculptor, Kevin Kresse.
Kevin has exhibited his work around Arkansas, New York, Washington DC, Memphis, and Atlanta. His work has been featured in the Arkansas Democrat-Gazette, the Arkansas Times, Soiree magazine, and more, and he has been featured in pieces produced by local affiliates of ABC, CBS, and PBS television, as well as a short film by Garret Lakin.
The journey toward a career in art began with Kresse and his wife Bridget’s decision to pare down their lives financially. Both of the Kresses had “job-jobs,” as Bridget calls them. She was a financial planner, Kevin a newspaper art director. Work and money had been “all about accumulation.” The Kresses opted for a different road.
They gave their employers a year’s notice, lived cheaply, and saved money. Then they took a four-month trip to Europe. The trip to Europe was priceless. It laid the foundation for their marriage, they say. It gave them time to reflect — something Kevin points out is growing increasingly scarce for workaholic Americans — and it pointed the way toward their future. It was on that trip, Bridget says, that “Kevin decided to do his art."
"It's a kick knowing that my public work will still be there long after I'm gone," he said. "I never thought about that aspect too much until after my father died. It is also great hearing people interpret what they see in some of the work. It makes me realize that everyone sees art through their filter of life and that every interpretation is just as valid as the reason I did it."
Listen to Learn:
- How Kevin won the right to sculpt Johnny Cash for display in Washington D.C.
- The process of bronzing a sculpture
- About the trip that changed Kevin's life, and more...
Podcast Links
TRANSCRIPT
EPISODE 412
[INTRODUCTION]
[00:00:09] GM: Welcome to Up in Your Business with Kerry McCoy, a production of flagandbanner.com. Through storytelling and conversational interviews, this weekly radio show and podcast offers listeners an insider’s view into commonalities of successful people and the ups and downs of risk-taking. Connect with Kerry through her candid, funny, informative, and always encouraging weekly blog. And now it's time for Kerry McCoy to get all up in your business.
INTERVIEW]
[00:00:33] KM: Thank you, Son Gray. After four decades of running a small business called Arkansas Flag & Banner, now simply called flagandbanner.com, my team and I decided to create a platform for not just me, but other business owners and successful people to pay forward our experiential knowledge in a conversational way. Originally, we thought we'd be teaching others. But it didn't take long before we realized that we were the persons learning. Listening to our guests has been both educational and inspiring. To quote the Dalai Lama, when you talk, you're only repeating what you already know. But when you listen, you may learn something new.
The act of listening is learning. As great philosopher Diogenes once wrote, "We have two ears and one tongue so that we may listen more." Most of my guests believe in a higher power, have the heart of a teacher, are creative. And, boy, the one today is creative. And they all work hard. Before I introduce today's guest, I want to let you know, if you miss any part of today's show or want to hear it again, there's a way, and Son Gray will tell you how.
[00:01:30] GM: All UIYB past and present interviews are available at Up In Your Business with Kerry McCoy's YouTube channel, Facebook page, the Arkansas Democrat Gazette's digital version, flagandbanner.com's website, or wherever you listen to podcasts. Just ask your smart speaker to play Up in Your Business with Kerry McCoy. And by subscribing to our YouTube channel or flagandbanner.com's email list, you will receive prior notification of that day's guest. Back to you, Kerry.
[00:01:58] KM: Thanks again, Gray. My guest today, the multi-talented visual artist, Mr. Kevin Kresse. It seems like every time I pick up the paper or turn on the TV, there's a new story about my friend, Kevin, and one of his many art projects. Kevin's work has been featured in the Arkansas Democrat Gazette, the Arkansas Times, and every other print or magazine you can think of in the state.
In video, he is continually being interviewed by affiliates of ABC, CBS, PBS television, as well as a short film by his friend, Garrett Larkin. And his talent was nationally recognized. Kevin's seven-foot-tall statue of Johnny Cash, with his guitar slung over his back, was selected to represent Arkansas and forever stand in Washington, D.C. at the United States Capitol. Kevin Kresse, known for his new drawings, oil paintings – are they oil or acrylic?
[00:02:55] KK: Oil.
[00:02:56] KM: That's what I thought. Oil paintings. That's why you're crazy. You know that stuff makes you crazy?
[00:02:59] KK: Oh. It goes right – yes. Seems right.
[00:03:01] KM: Go right to the brains. Yeah. Oil paintings. Haunting blue eyes and premature white hair, is now known for his sculptures and his large murals. You will recognize some, if not all of his current work, which are a commission bust of Arkansas drummer and singer, Levon Helm, of The Band. A seven-foot tall, 1,300-pound bronze statue of the famed ranger and war hero, General William Darby, from Fort Smith, Arkansas. A large outdoor mural in Northern Rock called, love this, Dog Town Proud. And I am. Two more large outdoor works on the Little Rock Seventh Street mural project. Sculptures at Mount St. Mary's and at St. Joseph Center of Arkansas. As I said, more recently, commissioned by the Senate to represent Arkansas in the nation's capital with a statue of his Johnny Cash. It is my pleasure to welcome to the table my friend, the talented and successful artist extraordinaire, Mr. Kevin Kresse.
[00:04:00] KK: Wow. I think we covered everything. I'm leaving.
[00:04:05] KM: I've interviewed you before. What do you think about my new digs?
[00:04:09] KK: Very nice.
[00:04:11] GM: There's air-conditioning here.
[00:04:13] KK: That's what was throwing me. I knew there was something I couldn't put my finger on.
[00:04:17] KM: It used to. It was 2017 the last time that I interviewed you. Yeah, there was no air-conditioning.
[00:04:24] KK: Well, and I was also laughing, because last time you interviewed me, you started asking about, "Well, how many did you sell your first show?" I was like, "None." "How many in the second show?" "None." "How many on your third?" "None." I'm sure you're thinking, "This is a show about successful entrepreneurs. And we might need to rethink asking you here."
[00:04:43] KM: I was going to ask you, you remember that, because I went back and listened to that show. And we got so tickled that we had to go to break.
[00:04:52] KK: I know. Because later I was thinking, "There should have been an intervention."
[00:04:56] KM: I was like, "Oh, yeah. When did you start?" He tells me. Then, "Oh, what did you sell?" "Nothing." "What –" "Nothing." I was like, "Oh, God. This is the worst interview I've ever done." We're not going to revisit that whole show. But I do want to tell our listeners, if they want to go back and hear the 2017 show, it talks about college and a career in art, and how there's really not a college degree that says, "Go out and be an artist." They all say go out and be an architect, or a designer, or an ad agency.
[00:05:33] KK: Sure.
[00:05:34] KM: And that you ou did that. And we talked about you and Bridget quitting your jobs and going to Italy. We talked about your family support in the last interview. And we talked about how long it took you to get started, which I believe you said was nine years before it could support you. Nine or 10. Something like that. The twins were born when you started making money.
[00:05:52] KK: Yeah. I was sputtering along doing okay before that. But of course, I wasn't responsible for, all of the sudden, twins. And Bridget wasn't working.
[00:06:03] KM: You were responsible for twins.
[00:06:05] KK: No. I mean, right before they were born.
[00:06:08] KM: No, you are really responsible for twins. You were there. That is why you have twins.
[00:06:11] KK: I was there. I was right there.
[00:06:14] KM: Any regrets about –
[00:06:18] KK: Well, we haven't done the DNA testing.
[00:06:20] KM: Oh. Well, they look too much like you.
[00:06:22] KK: Yeah. No. Yes, they do.
[00:06:23] KM: And they've got your artist sensibility, don't they?
[00:06:25] KK: Yes, they do. All three do.
[00:06:27] KM: I was going to say, is your daughter still –
[00:06:30] KK: She had her first show last month and just killed it.
[00:06:32] KM: Really? Where’s she living?
[00:06:32] KK: She broke my record. That's for sure.
[00:06:35] KM: Yeah. Because she had her first show and sold something.
[00:06:37] KK: Yeah. 80% of her show.
[00:06:39] KM: Really? Where was it?
[00:06:40] KK: It was at the New Deal Studio, down 20th in Louisiana.
[00:06:44] KM: In Little Rock, Arkansas?
[00:06:45] KK: In Little Rock, Arkansas.
[00:06:46] KM: I thought she was living in New York for some reason.
[00:06:47] KK: She was. She was doing some work up there, going back and forth. But no, she's living here.
[00:06:53] KM: What is your advice to your daughter?
[00:06:57] KK: My advice to my daughter.
[00:06:59] KM: About art.
[00:07:01] KK: Well, for instance, the New Deal Studio, Lee and John were really – I've been there before. It's all set up. And so, she had so much work. To have a gallery show, this was great, because she had tons of drawings. It was almost more like an art garage sale. I said, "Well, I wouldn't worry about doing a gallery show per se. Let's see if we can rent a space. Use whatever recognition that the Kresse name has with me and then my sister Cynthia's work." And Social media changes everything. You don't have to go run around putting up flyers on flagpoles like I did.
[00:07:43] KM: I bought your early work, thankfully, back when it was affordable.
[00:07:49] KK: Oh, just like Tesla stock.
[00:07:52] KM: Just like Tesla.
[00:07:53] KK: Exactly. The comparisons are eerie.
[00:07:57] KM: Anything you would have done differently today when you think back of those times when you first started out?
[00:08:04] KK: Sure. Everything. I don't know. I mean, I think having the job, the 8 to 5 job. was good. Because when things would get kind of dark, as far as the studio not selling or anything, I would go, "Well, it's better than an 8 to 5 job." It's good to have those experiences to compare and contrast. Because otherwise, I think an 8 to 5, when things were slow, might have looked like a bright, shiny thing that I would want to do –
[00:08:31] KM: But you didn't have an 8 to 5 job after you –
[00:08:34] KK: At college. I did.
[00:08:36] KM: Oh, you were a teacher.
[00:08:37] KK: No, I did advertising.
[00:08:40] KM: For college?
[00:08:41] KK: No. Right out of college.
[00:08:41] KM: Oh. Yes. Right after college. But you only did it for a couple of years. Then you quit and went straight into –
[00:08:47] KK: Yes, yes, yes. I'm just saying, when I was in the studio, when I was working on my own and things would look kind of bleak, you're by yourself all day. So you can get in your head way too easily and start swirling around the toilet. During those times, I'm saying an 8 to 5 job, if I had not had that experience, that could look like too much of a bright and shiny thing.
[00:09:07] KM: Oh, so you might have quit and gone back.
[00:09:09] KK: Yeah, and gone back into –
[00:09:10] KM: But you’d already done it.
[00:09:11] KK: I'd already done it. So I knew what it was about.
[00:09:12] KM: I'm with you.
[00:09:14] KK: I can share those experiences with my daughter. She's doing a little bit of that.
[00:09:18] KM: Today I want to talk – you married the perfect woman, because Bridget's been very supportive.
[00:09:22] KK: Oh, totally. Yeah. No. I mean, when the twins were coming, I was like, "I need to be responsible." I mean, digging behind the car seat for Taco Bell change, it's fine for me, but not so cool as a dad. Yeah, Bridget was the one who said, “That's not who you are. That's not who we are. We'll make this work.”
[00:09:43] KM: God, I love her. Today, I want to talk about what's happened since our last interview.
[00:09:48] KK: All righty.
[00:09:49] KM: The last time we spoke, you had a GoFund account trying to raise money to have Levon Helm’s bust bronzed.
[00:09:56] KK: Oh, right.
[00:09:57] KM: You need you needed 25,000. The GoFundMe was at 11,000. What's the status of that?
[00:10:02] KK: It is in his home.
[00:10:05] KM: Bronzed?
[00:10:06] KK: Bronze. Yes.
[00:10:07] KM: You raised the money.
[00:10:08] KK: Yes.
[00:10:09] KM: You got it bronzed. Then there was another piece of Levon Helm’s memorial or memorabilia. I don't know. Museum, I guess maybe it was. Was in Woodstock. There was a farm there also.
[00:10:20] KK: Yes. I'm still hoping that that'll work out to get a casting to go to Woodstock.
[00:10:27] KM: They’re still struggling to get his farm up there working.
[00:10:30] KK: Yeah. I think they're still –
[00:10:32] KM: That's his daughter. And your bust is in what city?
[00:10:36] KK: That's in Marvell, because he was from the suburb of Marvell. Turkey Scratch.
[00:10:41] GM: So great.
[00:10:44] KK: You can't make those things up.
[00:10:46] KM: No. Turkey Scratch.
[00:10:47] KK: Turkey Scratch. I love it so much.
[00:10:48] KM: Turkey Scratch, Arkansas.
[00:10:49] KK: The bust is in his home, which has been refurbished, redone.
[00:10:53] KM: And open to the public?
[00:10:54] KK: And it's open to the public.
[00:10:55] KM: Nice. Where is Turkey Scratch close to?
[00:10:57] KK: Over by Helena.
[00:10:58] KM: Oh, okay. Sure. Where all the music comes out of.
[00:11:00] KK: You bet.
[00:11:01] KM: I think the most interesting thing about the Levon Helm story from our last time we interviewed was how many times you watched the Last Waltz, to get an idea and to get to know the character. Then, how you finally decided on the bust pose. Tell our listeners what it is. Because when you see it, you know it.
[00:11:19] KK: Yeah. Well, it's him singing. He would put so much of himself when he was singing. I mean, he just amazes me, the physicality of his drumming, and then to be able to force all that volume of air out to be singing and then to be hearing. Especially in Last Waltz, he had horns binding. I mean, it's pretty phenomenal. Anyway, I had, I think, originally, maybe a vowel sound of "o" or something when he was singing.
[00:11:46] KM: No, it was the "n".
[00:11:48] KK: Was it? Well, I know. Then I said, "This isn't working." And I started reworking it until I could find one that I thought fit. Then I went, “Ah, there it is.” Actually, it's right in between the N and the I.
[00:12:00] KM: Oh, night.
[00:12:02] KK: The night. Yeah.
[00:12:03] KM: What's the tune?
[00:12:05] KK: It's The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down.
[00:13:01] KM: There it is, "The night."
[00:13:02] GM: This is the second show we've recorded that mom has decided to sing.
[00:13:06] KM: And I can't sing.
[00:13:07] KK: And she breaks into the same song every time.
[00:13:10] GM: No, it’s not always the Last Waltz.
[00:13:12] KM: They always talk about how I can't sing. And my son who's a freaking opera singer over there won’t help me.
[00:13:18] KK: No. See, I was going to jump in, just because that's us. But then I thought, but Bridget has a great ear. See? And I trigger migraines in her when I sing. I've learned to stop myself.
[00:13:28] KM: See? What Gray does. He's like, “Mom, please no.”
[00:13:31] KM: Tell the other Levon Helm story.
[00:13:33] KK: Well, no. I was just talking to his friends. I mean, everybody who knew him has a Levon Story. He’s just one of those charismatic personable characters. And I’ve heard so many different stories. But like I was saying, they’d say, “Oh, man. He’s a con. He’d need 500 bucks, he’d take 500 bucks and you would never see it again. But then he’d have $10,000 and give it away.” It just didn’t seem to matter that much to him. It was more about the experience I think that he was in at the moment.
[00:14:04] KM: You said he heard about —
[00:14:06] KK: Yeah. Paul Berry was telling me a story about this boyhood I think died of — I’m going to get the story right, but died of cancer something here in Arkansas and he was up in New York and drove all the way down. Got a buddy of his. They went and got a couple of harmonicas and worked out, I think, Amazing Grace. Went to the funeral, to the grave site service and played and put their harmonicas on the coffin and he walked off.
[00:14:28] KM: That’s a great story. All right, you had also just finished installing the William Darby statue in Fort Smith. There was a 90-year-old ranger there who was part of the Darby pier. Do you know if he's still alive?
[00:14:42] KK: He died a few months after that. I think, he might have been 95. Anyway, he was old. Yes. William Punch Gallop is his name.
[00:14:49] KM: Oh, you remember his name.
[00:14:50] KK: Yeah. His nickname was Punch, because he was the 1940s Golden Glove champ.
[00:14:55] KM: Was he the only guy that came for the installation of that statue?
[00:14:58] KK: Oh, no. There were tons of rangers there.
[00:14:59] KM: Oh, they were.
[00:15:00] KK: But he was the only one from Darby’s original 500 men. Then at the unveiling, all these rangers were lined up behind Punch in his wheelchair. And then Punch all called them to attention with his loud, booming voice. This is a soft-spoken man in a wheelchair and then just, “Ten-hut!” Just loud as you can imagine. Boy, they all – it was very – yeah. It was –
[00:15:25] KM: The nephew is Darby Watkins. And he said this about you, “Thank you, Kevin Kresse, for absolutely nailing his uncle’s image and personality,” and he went on to say, “When I look at that statue, I see a precautious boy with a wicked grin and a lust for life.” This big, seven-foot, 1,300-pound statue. I didn't realize that that ranger from Fort Smith started the rangers.
[00:15:49] KK: Yeah. In fact, they were called Darby’s Rangers.
[00:15:51] KM: All right. All right. This is a great place to take a break. When we come back, we'll continue our conversation with Kevin Kresse, the artist chosen and approved by the Senate to sculpt a bronze statue of Arkansas’ favorite son, Johnny Cash. His statue along with another artist's statue of Daisy Bates will stand in our nation's state capitol. They are Arkansas’ forever representation in Washington, D.C. We'll be right back.
[BREAK]
[00:16:17] GM: You're listening to Up in Your Business with Kerry McCoy, a production of flagandbanner.com. Over 40 years ago with only $400, Kerry founded Arkansas Flag and Banner. During the last four decades, the business has grown and changed along with Kerry's experience and leadership knowledge. In 1995, she embraced the internet and rebranded her company as simply, flagandbanner.com. In 2004, she became an early blogger. Since then, she has founded the non-profit Friends of Dreamland Ballroom. And in 2016, branched out into this very radio show, YouTube channel, and podcast.
In 2020, Kerry McCoy Enterprises acquired ourcornermarket.com, an online company specializing in American-made plaques, signage, and memorials for over 20 years. And more recently, opened a satellite office in Miami, Florida. Telling American-made stories, selling American-made flags, the flagandbanner.com. Back to you, Kerry.
[EPISODE CONTINUED]
[00:17:16] KM: You're listening to Up in Your Business with me, Kerry McCoy. I'm speaking today with renowned Little Rock artist, muralist, and sculptor, Kevin Kresse. Tell us, when you heard you'd been awarded the commission to represent Arkansas and sculpt the seven-foot-tall Johnny Cash and what you did.
[00:17:31] KK: Yeah. Okay. It's actually going to be eight feet. Yeah.
[00:17:36] GM: Even better.
[00:17:37] KM: Even better.
[00:17:38] KK: Then on a three-foot pedestal. It can't exceed 11-feet are the rules up there. He'll be 11-feet altogether.
[00:17:44] KM: Oh. And he's got the guitar on the back?
[00:17:46] KK: He’s got the guitar on the back. His left hand is over on his chest where the strap, the guitar strap goes through. Then in his right hand, kind of tucked back, is the Bible. He was actually an ordained minister. But –
[00:18:01] KM: Always, or just in his late –
[00:18:02] KK: I think his later part. His cousin told me that.
[00:18:04] KM: Oh. He get that online?
[00:18:07] KK: I have zero idea about that one.
[00:18:10] KM: That’s what I thought –
[00:18:12] KK: My husband is ordained, technically.
[00:18:13] KM: Your husband?
[00:18:15] KK: Who is my husband. Yes.
[00:18:17] KM: Well, anybody can get one.
[00:18:19] KK: That's exactly right.
[00:18:22] KM: Sorry, Drew. Go ahead.
[00:18:24] KK: Anyway, so how did this come about? Okay, this is interesting. When I did the bust of Levon, I was talking to the people in Marvell. The house was not open at this point. It's just one of those little shotgun houses with a little porch that runs the length of the house. And they said they would find people from all over on his porch. That'd be from Japan, New Zealand, all over Europe. And they were just coming to see where Levon grew up. I thought, "This is amazing." Because a lot of people don't know who Levon Helm is.
[00:18:58] KM: Yeah.
[00:18:59] KK: And I just started thinking back then of all the amazing influential musical artists that come, especially from the Arkansas Delta side. I started going, "See? We have Johnny Cash. There's Al Green."
[00:19:14] KM: Rosetta Tharpe.
[00:19:35] KK: Sister Rosetta Tharpe. 10 miles down the road is Louis Jordan. Those two are probably the two people most responsible for rock and roll music.
Big Bill Broonzy. There’s the Silverfox, Charlie Rich.
[00:20:20] KM: Charlie Rich is from Arkansas?
[00:20:21] KK: Colt. Colt, Arkansas.
There's Conway Twitty.
[00:20:53] KM: Oh, Conway Twitty. Yeah.
[00:20:55] KK: Of course, then move over. Glen Campbell is over from Delight and everything. Anyway, I just started cataloging all these people.
[00:21:01] KM: Louis Jordan.
[00:21:02] KK: He's from Brinkley. Right. I mean, I can keep going. I mean, William Grant Still from Little Rock, first African-American to have a major orchestra performance. Same as a female is Florence Price who's from Little Rock.
[00:21:16] KM: Yeah, Florence Price.
[00:21:17] KK: Pharaoh Sanders from North Little Rock.
[00:21:19] KM: Oh, my gosh. It does just go on and on.
[00:21:21] KK: It's incredible. I was like, why are we not promoting these people? And so, at that point, I just started a little build that nail, hopefully, they'll come, project on my own. I started sculpting bust. And I did Johnny Cash 1960s version.
[00:21:39] KM: What's that? What would that look like?
[00:21:41] KK: Oh, just short hair, the pompadour.
[00:21:44] KM: Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
[00:21:46] KK: I did Al Green. I did Sister Rosetta Tharpe. Started on Louis Jordan. I did Glen Campbell. All these are all my own. They're not cast yet or anything.
[00:21:56] KM: They're all sitting around in your –
[00:21:57] KK: Yeah. I have my little Madame Tussaud's thing in my house for a while now. They’re over in the –
[00:22:04] GM: Please tell me they’re not made of wax.
[00:22:08] KM: Are you going to sell them?
[00:22:10] KK: Well, the idea that I have is I want to find the funding, maybe a foundation grant funded. I'd like to cast two. I'd like to find a central location. Especially maybe downtown, where the tourists are coming through. Well, actually, for Arkansas, yours as well. So many people don't know that these people are from here.
[00:22:32] KM: Right.
[00:22:33] KK: And have them grouped. Then the other casting go to the hometowns of all these people.
[00:22:39] KM: What do you mean two castings? You mean –
[00:22:41] KK: Cast the sculpture twice. Have one casting here for the group. And then the other one in the hometowns.
[00:22:47] GM: And you're thinking a sculpture garden downtown or something like that?
[00:22:52] KK: Something where they're together until you get the power of walking around and people going, “Oh, I didn't know Al Green was from Arkansas.” We were just talking, “Oh, I didn't know he was from Arkansas.”
[00:23:01] GM: That sounds so cool.
[00:23:04] KM: I’m so in love with that idea.
[00:23:06] KK: I know. Me too. Yeah, I think it would be incredible.
[00:23:09] KM: Let’s see. How many of those played in Dreamland? Louis Jordan.
[00:23:13] GM: Al Green did, didn't he? No?
[00:23:14] KM: I don't know if Al Green did. But I know Rosetta Tharpe did.
[00:23:18 KK: That’s the idea. I started that on my own. Okay, here's the other weird thing. When we were living in Italy for a year in 2010 to 2011, we met a couple from Portland, Oregon. Nick and I just – he reminded me of my two best friends. I could blend. We just started messing with each other. They had two daughters, and they were wanting to do a year in Italy. They ended up picking our brains a lot about how we pulled it off. They ended up doing a year in Genoa. Probably around that same time we did the interview, Jacqueline, the wife, she wrote a book on how to do a year abroad. And so, she emailed me and said, “I've got a bunch of fact-checking questions, because you and Bridget are in the book quite a bit."
Anyway, I answered those. She goes, “What are you working on?” I said, “Well, right now, I'm doing a bust of Johnny Cash for this project that I've got going on my own.” She goes, “Oh, I'm friends with his youngest daughter, Tara. She lives here in Portland, and we're in a writer’s group together. Do you want me to connect you two?” I said, "This is too great." And we were born two days apart. Tara and I were born two days apart. We became pen pals. I would send her pictures. I still haven't met her in person.
[00:24:36] KM: Still?
[00:24:37] KK: No. During all this process, then I started hearing the talk about the possible D.C. project. Now Daisy Bates was chosen first. And she was in. Then there was a lot of discussion about who the other person was going to be. I think towards the end, it kind of was coming down between Johnny and Sam Walton.
[00:24:57] KM: Oh, interesting.
[00:24:59] KK: Yeah. Anyway, obviously, we know how that turned out.
[00:25:04] KM: They picked Johnny Cash before they saw your sculpture, or did they –
[00:25:11] KK: Yes. No, that had nothing to do –
[00:25:12] KM: Nothing to do with it.
[00:25:13] KK: Nothing to do with it.
[00:25:15] KM: You heard that was going to be Johnny Cash, so you thought –
[00:25:17] KK: Oh, I had my pom poms out going hard.
[00:25:21] KM: Go Johnny. Go.
[00:25:21] KK: Go Johnny.
[00:25:22] KM: Go Johnny go. I'm going to sing again. No. How did you apply?
[00:25:28] KK: Man, it was like writing your thesis paper and doing your taxes. 10 years of tax. It was a long application.
[00:25:39] KM: How long did it take you?
[00:25:41] KK: It took a long time. I think my packet was almost 48 pages long, something. With photos and all that kind of stuff.
[00:25:48] KM: So you FedEx it up there, I guess?
[00:25:50] KK: Well, I was able to bring mine in and drop it off hand. Drop it off at the Capitol, since I was about two minutes before the deadline. So typical with me.
[00:25:58] KM: Such an artist. That's good. They got to see you.
[00:26:04] KK: Yeah, for whatever that was worth. I handed that off. Yeah. Then I was told I was in the top three. Then we were given, I'm trying to think now, maybe a few months to come up with the models to present to the committees.
[00:26:20] KM: The three of you have to come up with models.
[00:26:22] KK: Yes.
[00:26:23] KM: Okay. You contacted your senator by now? Are you thinking, "I need some help on the inside?"
[00:26:31] KK: You know, that was crossing my mind. But I didn't want to have that. I wanted to win on my own bona fides.
[00:26:39] KM: Don't be so naive. Call in everybody.
[00:26:43] GM: Artist integrity, mother. Artist integrity.
[00:26:46] KK: Well, and not only that. I ended up cutting off conversation with Tara and everybody, because I didn't want any –
[00:26:53] KM: Influence.
[00:26:54] KK: Yeah. Well, I didn't want anybody coming back, "Oh, that wasn't fair. He's friends with Johnny's daughter," or anything like that.
[00:27:00] KM: Oh, I got you. Okay. So now you're down. You got to put three together and you're thinking, "I've got three months. What am I going to sculpt?" Did you already know what you want to sculpt? I mean, you've done one of him in the 1960s. And you're thinking, "Am I going to do the slick pompadour?"
[00:27:14] KK: Right. I ended up thinking, probably early 1970s, when he had the TV show was probably his most recognizable timeframe. And so, I had already zeroed in on thinking I needed to do that time. He was healthy. It's a good stretch there.
[00:27:31] KM: Is that what you did, the 70s? Is that statue of the 70s? He had long hair.
[00:27:38] KK: Yeah. He was probably around 40 at that time.
[00:27:40] KM: He had long hair on the statue.
[00:27:42] KK: Yeah. It's in between when the pompadour is growing out, and then the hair is getting longer on the back. Yeah, that type of thing.
[00:27:48] KM: What's Johnny Cash thinking?
[00:27:50] KK: For me, it's an emotional goal that I'm after, right?
[00:27:53] KM: Yes.
[00:27:54] KK: I created a story in my head about what's going on. The dream sequence that I had going was Johnny comes back. He's going to play at the festival. His own festival. He hasn't seen the house refurbished yet. He's gone through the house for the first time. He's reliving all these memories. He comes out on the porch and he's getting ready to go play. That's why he has this guitar and everything. And he's looking down. He's looked out at the fields. He’s thinking about his brother that died and everything. Then he's looking down reflecting on his life before he gets ready to walk over to the stage. It's this very introspective time. And Johnny has an extremely difficult face.
[00:28:37] KM: He does. Why?
[00:28:37] KK: Because you're taught mouth, nose, eyes, parallel, center line. All of his is slightly off.
[00:28:45] KM: What?
[00:28:46] KK: Yes. Nose kicks off a little bit this way. The eyes and the mouth are kind of moving at a different angle towards one another. And so, if you do what you're supposedly supposed to do as an artist, it's just not going to look like him.
[00:29:00] KM: He's not very attractive. Let's just be honest.
[00:29:02] KK: Oh, I think he's amazing.
[00:29:04] KM: It's weird how some people think he's attractive.
[00:29:07] GM: He's fascinating looking. He's always got that cocked eyebrow and that solid cowboy kind of thing. Very intense.
[00:29:16] KK: Those dark eyes –
[00:29:17] KM: I just think he has a presence. But I don't think he's somebody you'd see on a poster and go, “That's a good-looking guy.” It's about his presence, I think, more than anything.
[00:29:26] KK: Yes. I’ll give you that.
[00:29:28] KM: Okay. Thanks. You take it up there. And then how long did you have to wait?
[00:29:35] KK: It seemed like forever. Because I was just dying. I felt good about it. I mean, after the presentations.
[00:29:43] KM: Did you have to do an oral presentation with it?
[00:29:44] KK: Oh, yeah. Yeah.
[00:29:46] KM: Well, who could not like you anyway? That seals the deal right there.
[00:29:50] KK: No. I mean –
[00:29:52] KM: You're a good artist in the way that you can also articulate and sell yourself. Not all artists can do that. Some artists are so in their head all the time that it's hard for them to get the words out. But you have a good gift of gab, too.
[00:30:04] KK: Made words put together make sentence. Many make paragraph. Yes.
[00:30:10] KM: Exactly. How long did you have to wait? A couple of weeks? Months?
[00:30:13] KK: No. It was maybe a week or so.
[00:30:16] KM: Okay. That's not very long. You get the phone call. Is that how you got it?
[00:30:20] KK: Yeah.
[00:30:21] KM: Did your senator call you?
[00:30:21] KK: Actually, I was down Boulevard, down on Main Street. The guy at the Secretary of State's Office.
[00:30:25] KM: Arkansas?
[00:30:26] KK: Yeah, here. Was calling. In fact, when I left after the presentations, I told him, I said, “Listen, if I don't win, text me. I promise, I will call you back. I will be too heartbroken to hear the news verbally. Just text me.” And so, I'm at the Boulevard down on Main Street. Actually, I'm with my old friend. I happened to run, Robert Best.
[00:30:49] KM: Oh, yeah. Another sculptor.
[00:30:50] KK: Robert’s, yeah, down there. I'm talking. I'm going, “Yeah, I'm waiting. Da, da, da, da.” Then I look down and I see that the – it’s actually the State's office is calling.
[00:30:58] KM: You’re like, “I told him to only call if I won.”
[00:31:00] GM: Or did. Did you just lose it right there in the middle of the restaurant?
[00:31:03] KK: Oh, I got teary-eyed. Yeah. I mean, yeah.
[00:31:05] KM: I’m about to get teary-eyed just thinking about it. I’ve got goosebumps on my legs. You’re going to cry again right now.
[00:31:10] KK: I am going to cry again.
[00:31:11] KM: Always cries on the show.
[00:31:14] KK: Bridget and I invited all the artists over to our house for dinner after the presentations.
[00:31:19] KM: Oh. You made your presentation in Arkansas?
[00:31:21] KK: Yeah. At the Capitol here.
[00:31:22] KM: Oh, I was thinking you did it at the Capitol in Washington, D.C.
[00:31:24] KK: No. No. No. No. I'm sorry. No, we were here in Little Rock.
[00:31:27] KM: Oh, I get you.
[00:31:28] KK: Yeah. Benjamin had come in from Idaho. A friend, Brett, came down from Grand Rapids, Michigan. Yeah.
[00:31:36] KM: Now, y'all are all friends.
[00:31:37] KK: Yeah. We invited everybody over for dinner. He came. His wife was pregnant. Then Brett came. The other woman had to catch a flight. So she couldn't. The other guy –
[00:31:49] KM: Were there very many female sculptors?
[00:31:51] KK: Just one. That was in the final.
[00:31:53] KM: Are there very many in the whole industry of sculpting? Are the very many female sculptors?
[00:31:58] KK: Not a lot.
[00:32:00] KM: I would think not.
[00:32:00] KK: Not a lot.
[00:32:01] KM: Let's talk about the process. You might get into – I kind of heard this. I watched your French Hill interview that you did I think a week or so ago. I remember you telling him that you made it three-feet tall. Then you took photographs of it all the way around and send it off to somebody who then makes a Styrofoam replication.
[00:32:24] KK: Oh, whoa, whoa.
[00:32:25] KM: Because I'm like, how do you get from three feet to that?
[00:32:27] KK: To eight feet. Well, you either do it – you either just do your own armature out of metal, steel, rebar and build it up yourself. Or what I'm doing right now, it's the three-foot version is I take it, they scan it vertically, and then move the whole piece one degree. Scan until they go 360 times around.
[00:32:49] GM: Make a 3D model?
[00:32:51] KK: Yeah. They have large blocks of foam. And it's like a wooden lathe. And I say, "I wanted eight feet." And computer says that and it goes – and starts carving it all the way down vertically. And the whole block of foam turns one degree. And it does it again and cuts it out. The final piece, it's not like –
[00:33:09] KM: It is 3D modeling.
[00:33:09] GM: Yeah. I was going to say it's 3D printing.
[00:33:12] KK: But it’s foam. Because if I'm off a little bit, then I'm off more on the big one. I can use a knife and I can cut to see if I need to shave off or I just build the clay up. It makes a lightweight armature. It's not done. It looked like my model – almost like a light coat of snow on it. That's about the detail I get. I'm articulating, re-sculpting everything with the clay on top of that. But it gives me a lot of flexibility. I can cut the head off, look at it from all angles. Put it back on. Cut the hand off, work it, put it back on. It's great for that.
[00:33:48] KM: Wow. I love this whole idea.
[00:33:51] GM: Yeah, that's cool. I had no idea.
[00:33:53] KM: All right. Now, we're going to talk about where to find all of your outdoor – I think, you're really into outdoor. This is just me thinking. But you used to be into drawing nudes, which I actually have a couple of. What did your wife think about you always drawing naked women? I've never asked you that. I’ve often wondered. I meant to ask Bridget actually that, "What do you think about your husband going to work with naked women every day?"
[00:34:21] KK: Well, it wasn't every day. They weren't all nudes. And there are also plenty of nude males.
[00:34:27] KM: I have a male. I have a nude –
[00:34:28] KK: Okay. Well, see? There you go.
[00:34:29] KM: There you go.
[00:34:30] KK: She never thought twice about it. I mean, I've been doing it since college. She just always said – because she had friends go and ask her that. Well, he's by himself in a studio with some female who doesn't have any clothes on.
[00:34:46] KM: That's not free to call this movie, with Diego.
[00:34:49] GM: Oh, Lord.
[00:34:51] KK: Yeah, Diego and I are just –
[00:34:53] KM: You’re Diego. You have too much Catholic guilt to do anything.
[00:34:58] KK: Exactly. No, she just said, “Well, that's his job. That's what he does.”
[00:35:04] KM: Was it an incident that happened that took you from drawing and painting? Or was it just this organic change?
[00:35:11] KK: It was an organic change. When I started teaching it down in the museum school, at the art center, that was probably right when I got married, '92. Then I started jumping into sculpture classes. Those water-based ones you fire like pottery or something. And so, appendages, fingers and male appendages might be getting broken off when you're moving the sculptures around. And so, then I went – I went out to UA Little Rock and learned how to cast bronze. I started doing that. Then Bridget's old friend, her dad had one of these starter castles overlooking the river and I had a spot for a sculpture in front of his house.
[00:35:55] GM: Starter castle?
[00:35:56] KK: Yeah. It’s just one of those nude –
[00:35:58] KM: A starter castle.
[00:35:59] KK: Those big houses. Anyway.
[00:36:01] GM: Yeah. Anyway, go ahead.
[00:36:02] KK: Anyway, his wife was the decorator, but she had passed away. Anyway, I was talking with him. Anyway, ended up doing my first bronze.
[00:36:08] KM: Is that the one you did in the back of my house?
[00:36:09] KK: No.
[00:36:11] KM: Remember the big huge picture you did of a working man in the back of Flag and Banner. We would all go –
[00:36:16] KK: Oh. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. It’s like a John Henry on steroids. Yes. That’s right.
[00:36:23] KM: I don't know if son Gray knows this, but the back where the warehouse is where our flags are now used to just be an empty warehouse. All these artists used to get to use it for free, because –
[00:36:32] KK: Oh, it was. It’s a great space.
[00:36:33] KM: Was that the sculptor you're talking about?
[00:36:35] KK: Yes. That’s exactly the sculpture I'm talking about.
[00:36:36] KM: That was the beginning –
[00:36:37] KK: That was my very first large sculpture.
[00:36:39] KM: It was huge.
[00:36:40] KK: Yeah. It was life-size. A little bit over life-size. Did that. That was my first bronze. Then Giana Smith saw that and he brought me on to do Baptist Hospital, which was a totally different thing. Anyway.
[00:36:57] KM: What did you do for Baptist?
[00:36:58] KK: Good Samaritan scene. It's in the garden in Little Rock Baptist Hospital.
[00:37:03] KM: In the garden out front?
[00:37:04] KK: Yeah.
[00:37:05] KM: Out front.
[00:37:06] KK: Right. It’s very loose.
[00:37:09] KM: There's one you can go see.
[00:37:09] KK: Yeah, very loose. Anyway. And then that. When I was working on almost finishing that up, then the library had a call for entries for a writer, D. Brown, Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee, for the D. Brown library. I ended up winning that. And that was my first –
[00:37:26] KM: Where's that library?
[00:37:27] KK: It's in Southwest City on Baseline, I think. Anyway, just like I said, I like Tarzan. I've got a vine I'm swinging for and I'm looking for the next one. It's been like that for 20 something years.
[00:37:39] KM: It just keeps evolving.
[00:37:40] KK: It does.
[00:37:42] KM: That is, I think, something about all entrepreneurs and artists and actors to me are the ultimate entrepreneurs, because they never know where their next dime is coming from.
[00:37:52] KK: You don’t.
[00:37:53] KM: I had Joy Lauren Adams on here one time and I said, "You're the ultimate entrepreneur, because you're always working on the next project." She said, “I never think of myself as an entrepreneur.” I said, "Oh, my gosh. You, an artist – you freelance people are the ultimate."
[00:38:05] KK: Right. Yeah, you got to wear a lot of hats, for sure.
[00:38:08] KM: Then after that one, you did – we've told our listeners, we're telling them there's the Baptist Hospital.
[00:38:16] KK: Oh, in town. Okay. Yeah.
[00:38:18] KM: The Baptist Hospital, the one at the library.
[00:38:20] KK: Well, I'm trying to think around town. I mean, these are out of order. I mean –
[00:38:24] KM: How about Mother Earth in North Little Rock?
[00:38:26] KK: That's still one of my favorites.
[00:38:28] KM: Is that what it's called? Mother Earth?
[00:38:29] KK: Yes.
[00:38:29] KM: Where is it?
[00:38:31] KK: It is on 5th Street, in between Main and Maple. Kind of behind Capaio’s Restaurant.
[00:38:36] KM: That's a nice one. And you kind of play on that when kids can come all over.
[00:38:39] KK: Yeah. Right.
[00:38:40] GM: Oh, that one. I love that one. I didn’t know you did that one.
[00:38:42] KK: Thanks. Yeah.
[00:38:44] KM: Then St. Joseph for Arkansas.
[00:38:46] KK: St. Joseph. Yeah, I did a donation. Right. I did that.
[00:38:49] KM: And that is at the old St. Joseph Orphanage. Can people see that one?
[00:38:55] KK: Yeah. It's over by the garden area. It's over life-size cement.
[00:39:00] KM: What is it?
[00:39:01] KK: It's the patron saint of gardening, St. Fiacre. He's holding up –
[00:39:08] KM: It’s not St. Francis?
[00:39:08] KK: No.
[00:39:08] GM: That’s animals.
[00:39:11] KM: Saint what?
[00:39:12] KK: It’s Fiacre.
[00:39:16] GM: I can’t Google it.
[00:39:17] KK: He also is the patron saint, I'm not joking, of Parisian taxicab drivers. He's busy. He's a busy dude.
[00:39:27] KM: Do you have to be Parisian?
[00:39:29] KK: Evidently. I don't know. Yeah.
[00:39:31] GM: Rigtht. Specifically, Parisian taxi drivers.
[00:39:32] KM: Well, they probably need some.
[00:39:33] KK: They do. I did that, because my parents actually met at St. Joseph’s. They would have carnivals there every year for the parochial schools.
[00:39:43] KM: At the orphanage?
[00:39:44] KK: Yeah, they'd have these carnivals. Dad was at little St. Mary's. My mom was at St. Edward's, and they met there as teenagers. Probably 1930s.
[00:39:51] KM: You mean, as they were little bitty students, they met and would go to carnivals there.
[00:39:56] KK: Yeah, all the parochial school students, once a year, they would have a carnival there.
[00:40:00] GM: So cute.
[00:40:03] KK: They were in high school. They were teenagers.
[00:40:05] KM: Tell our listeners how many brothers and sisters you have.
[00:40:07] KK: Last count? I had 10. 10 brothers and sisters.
[00:40:10] KM: You said you had.
[00:40:13] KK: Actually, I have lost a couple of sisters.
[00:40:15] KM: Are they older than you, I guess.
[00:40:17] KK: Yes. The oldest, Karen. That's actually who I dedicated the mother a fountain to. Then just not quite two years ago, Kathy, the second oldest. But yeah, I grew up with six older sisters. That's why I always said I had seven mothers. That's what I’m always telling Bridget. You are so lucky. You got me housebroken. You don’t even realize.
[00:40:39] KM: That's true.
[00:40:40] KK: It was true. Very true.
[00:40:41] KM: Or they spoiled you rotten.
[00:40:42] KK: No. No.
[00:40:43] KM: That could have happened.
[00:40:43] KK: No. None of that was going on.
[00:40:45] KM: Let's see. Then you did the Darby. William Darby Ranger in Fort Smith. You had one in the river market? There's all the sculpture gardens.
[00:40:54] KK: Yeah, the river market. Yeah, I have one in the river market.
[00:40:57] KM: Which one?
[00:40:58] KK: It’s the one of the guy in a suit in a wheelbarrow with a kid that has been pushing and it stopped pushing him. And it's just leaning up against him.
[00:41:07] KM: Do you know that one?
[00:41:07] GM: Mm-hmm. I've seen that one. Is it one of the ones by the –
[00:41:11] KK: It's close to that little gazebo near the main street.
[00:41:14] GM: Okay.
[00:41:15] TM: In the time since this interview was conducted with Kevin Kresse, he's finished yet another mural in downtown North Little Rock this time. He has announced that after working for over a year on a mural at the Jim Wetherington Boys and Girls Club in North Little Rock, at 1212 Jim Wetherington Place, it's complete. This description comes from the Arkansas Times. Kresse clocked many an hour playing basketball at that very facility as a young boy. And he started on the mural in May of 2023. Right around the time the club celebrated its 100th year in operation.
The mural covers two sides of the building. One facing 13th Street. The other facing Main Street. And it's approximately 25-feet tall. The mural depicts kids involved in all kinds of inspirational activities and adult too. That inspiration spreading adult depicted in the mural is Hearne Fine Art owner Garbo Hearne.
[00:42:09] KM: Do you have a favorite?
[00:42:11] KK: I think Mother Earth is one of my favorite big public ones. Just because it's so is different. And I saw it in my head and I'd never done a cement sculpture like that. I'd never done mosaics before.
[00:42:27] KM: Yeah. We didn't need to tell people that Mother Earth is a cement sculpture.
[00:42:31] KK: Yes.
[00:42:32] KM: All these other ones we've talked about are bronze.
[00:42:34] KK: Yeah, bronze. Right. Right. Anyway, that was a journey to get that one.
[00:42:40] KM: You like doing musicians, obviously. We talked about that already. It sounds like you like doing religion too, because you did a big –
[00:42:48] KK: I did a big relief for St. Michael's Hospital in Texarkana. I did another outdoor big relief for St. Michael's south of that. They called me and they said, “We took over a hospital in Atlanta, and we're wondering if you –” I was like, “Yeah, my best friend’s in Atlanta. I'd love to." Atlanta, Texas. Anyway, I did –
[00:43:10] KM: You did one at Mount St. Mary's, too, didn’t you?
[00:43:12] KK: That’s right. Yes. I did a resurrection crucifix for the chapel. But yeah. No. I like doing hospitals.
[00:43:24] KM: I heard you say everybody sees something different.
[00:43:27] KK: They always do. I think what I like about the setting of a hospital is that typically, all the people that are there, that's where they need art the most. I think that's where it can really serve its best purpose, as opposed to just being outside somewhere. That's great, too. But they're emotionally at a point where art can really do its best work.
[00:43:55] KM: Yeah, when you're suffering.
[00:43:57] KK: Yeah. Or full of anxiety, because you don't know how things are going to be going and all those mix of emotions.
[00:44:03] KM: Do you think art is cathartic for you?
[00:44:06] KK: Totally. Totally.
[00:44:08] KM: Could you not not do it?
[00:44:09] KK: No.
[00:44:10] KM: You have to do it.
[00:44:11] GM: Not – you could not –
[00:44:11] KK: I understood.
[00:44:13] KM: Did I say that right?
[00:44:14] KK: I heard you. I heard you.
[00:44:19] KM: He speaks Kerry. Thank you. All right, this is our last break. Still to come, why art matters to communities. And tips for budding artist, entrepreneurs.
[BREAK]
[00:44:28] GM: All UIYB past and present interviews are available at Up in Your Business with Kerry McCoy's YouTube channel, Facebook page, the Arkansas Democrat Gazette’s digital version, flagandbanner.com’s website, or wherever you listen to podcasts. Just ask your smart speaker to play Up in Your Business with Kerry McCoy. And by subscribing to our YouTube channel, or flagandbanner.com’s email list, you will receive prior notification of that day's guest.
[EPISODE CONTINUED]
[00:44:55] KM: You're listening to Up in Your Business with me, Kerry McCoy. I'm speaking today with my longtime friend, artist extraordinaire, Mr. Kevin Kresse. We called him a treasure at the last break, but we're not going to say that again, because we don't want his head to get too big. Talk about why art matters to a community. You said something when you were interviewing with French Hill that struck me so – because I'm a businesswoman. For every dollar spent on art, how much comes back to the community?
[00:45:28] KK: This was something I had heard somewhere. I can't remember where I heard it. This was several years back when Pulaski Tech does this business of art deal. Jim Carville, they pick one artist, one business person. Jim Carville, Arvest Bank was the business guy. Obviously, I was their guy that was honored that year. We had lunch the week before to get to know one another. I told him, I said, I heard that for every dollar community invest in the arts, there's an $11 return. Then I went later that night, well, I need to add stuff up, because we all have these BS detectors in our pockets now. You can't get away. It's not as much as phone as it used to be to have a conversation.
[00:46:08] GM: Oh, God.
[00:46:10] KK: I looked it up and do terrible research in Michigan. In Michigan, they found an over $50 return for every dollar invested.
[00:46:19] KM: I was shocked at that.
[00:46:21] KK: The average that I was finding was in the 30s.
[00:46:25] KM: For every dollar invested in your community, you get a $30 return.
[00:46:30] KK: In the arts. You started thinking about musical events, or theater, and all these types of things.
[00:46:38] KM: Yeah, restaurants.
[00:46:40] KK: Sure. That people come in down for all these –
[00:46:42] KM: Restaurants, hotels, taxi cab, Uber, airplanes, all this stuff to come see the art.
[00:46:50] KK: Right. That's why I'm so behind everything that John Gaudin has been doing in Argenta, because he's really been leading with art. For instance, the Mother Earth. I mean, he trusts the artists so much. I mean, he just came to me, he said, "Can you do something peaceful for this place?" Also, that pocket park could have easily had another townhome built on it. They didn't have to reserve it for a little private park.
[00:47:16] KM: Yes. And have tax coming in for it.
[00:47:19] KK: Right. It's that thinking.
[00:47:20] KM: You've done two murals. One of your murals you did was for him.
[00:47:25] KK: Yes, two. I did two for him.
[00:47:27] KM: Oh, you did the one, the Dogtown. Wonderful.
[00:47:31] KK: Thanks. The first one I did was the bicycling mural at 7th and Main. This people coming off the big dam bridge, riding the bicycles. Actually, I put Bridget walking our dog, Daisy. She's on the left side. Then my old neighbor from Italy. I painted him in that one as well, because he's a big bicyclist.
[00:47:52] KM: Bicycler.
[00:47:53] KK: Bicycler. Bicycler. See, I'm breaking into song.
[00:47:57] GM: I love this. Keep going, everyone.
[00:47:59] KK: Yeah, so just that one. We were just pitching out all the different artists' pitch ideas. For years, I've been saying, claim Dogtown.
[00:48:08] KM: Me too. I'm with you on that. I think it's adorable.
[00:48:12] KK: Yeah. I've always said, it's not dead rotting, stinking possum down. Dogtown has swagger. Claim it and own it. I brought the idea. He loved it. I think the mayor was a little dubious about it. I think the committee people all said, "No. We need to do this."
The thing I love about working on a mural – because when you put a piece of sculpture out, you're there for the installation. You're there for a bit. During the life of a mural, you're there, obviously every day painting it. You're interacting with the people more than you would be normally. It was so great, because they're just honking, “We love it. I need a t-shirt. I need a sweatshirt.”
[00:48:53] KM: You make t-shirts?
[00:48:54] KK: I haven’t. I think, they –
[00:48:55] KM: They need to make a t-shirt like that.
[00:48:56] KK: Right. Anyway, so that was a lot of fun to see that reaction. But the first one I did was right before that was the 7th Street underpass in Little Rock.
[00:49:08] KM: Yes.
[00:49:10] KK: That was my first time to do a mural.
[00:49:12] KM: That was your first mural?
[00:49:14] KK: Yeah. Was that two years ago? Anyway.
[00:49:17] KM: Yeah. You just did another one recently. The 7th Street project in North Little Rock is under the train – I mean, in Little Rock is under the train bridge. How did that even come about?
[00:49:27] KK: Probably 10 years ago or so, the Arkansas peace coalition, or coalition for peace, they were doing some murals down there. There was a lot of confusion about who owns the walls. Does the city own the wall? Does the railroad own the walls? Blah, blah, blah. Then they would get there a mural painted over.
[00:49:46] KM: By who?
[00:49:48] KK: Good question. I think, it was the Department of Transportation, I think. It's that type of thing where it was a little unclear about all of this stuff. After the George Floyd murder, then Jose Hernandez went down. Then Jermaine Gibson and did all the names. Jose painted the portrait of George Floyd. Then afterwards, it was just this influx of art. It's a very organic. Just very grassroots.
[00:50:15] KM: It was totally organic.
[00:50:16] KK: Yeah, no committee could have come up with that.
[00:50:19] KM: No one stopped you.
[00:50:21] KK: The very first day I was there, some police came and asked about who gave us permission. After that, one of the guys from the Department of Transportation came down, I was talking to him, and he said, “Oh, we've been given word. Don't touch it.”
[00:50:39] KM: Who does own it? Who owned the wall? The railroad, or the –
[00:50:42] KK: I think it's something funny, like right underneath the bridge. I mean, under the railroad tracks, that section, that middle section, I think the railroad owns that. I think the city owns the outer parts.
[00:50:53] KM: Yeah, that is odd.
[00:50:54] KK: It's the last I heard.
[00:50:56] KM: I went down there and looked at your latest drawing, or mural, I mean. And it's of my friend, John Kane, where we last did –
[00:51:06] GM: So good.
[00:51:08] KM: So good. For our listeners, John Kane has been in this city forever.
[00:51:14] KK: Talk about a treasure. Now he's a treasure.
[00:51:15] KM: He is an absolute treasure.
[00:51:18] GM: Go back and listen to his interview.
[00:51:19] KM: We interviewed him. Every time you listen to it, you just love it. He's got to be 90-years-old. He's never owned a car. He walks everywhere and rides the bus. You stop him and you say, “Hey, John. You want a ride?” He goes, "Nope. I’ll make a big freezing call."
[00:51:31] KK: Yes. I have done that several times. I have to get up so crazy early for some crazy reason. He's there, he is walking down. I’m like, “John, let me.” “Oh, I’m good, good.”
[00:51:40] KM: No. I think this is really interesting about him. He never writes down a phone number. Did you know that?
[00:51:47] KK: No.
[00:51:48] KM: He remembers everybody's phone number. I said, “John, here, call me back.” He said, “Which phone number?” Well, write it down. “I’m not going to write it down.” I said, “Well, what was it?” He reads it back to me. I go, “How can you remember it?” He goes, “I can just remember everybody’s phone number.” He can remember any phone number. Ain’t that weird?
[00:52:04] GM: That’s some dark magic there. I don't want that. I don't want that in my head.
[00:52:10] KM: Then I went and looked at the other mural you did down there of a bunch of guys. Who are those guys?
[00:52:18] KK: Oh, I did just five people taking a knee, locking arms. It's just that idea of unity. There's a couple white people, Hispanic person, a person – Asian person.
[00:52:30] KM: Just people.
[00:52:31] KK: Yeah. I did take the face, the central face from my friend, Ebony Levins, who’s a photographer. And she took this portrait of someone during one of the protests that was just haunting me. I asked her permission to use that for the center.
[00:52:45] KM: What do you want next? I mean, golly, you're just cooking with gas right now. What do you want next?
[00:52:50] KK: I would love the idea of these Arkansas musicians to find some traction and get the funding and make that happen.
[00:52:56] KM: Be displayed together. All right. I can't give you the present I give to everybody, because you've already gotten a desk set from me, with a US flag, and Arkansas flag, and an Italy flag at the time that you were there. I had to think of something else. It looks like my people in the showroom gave you an Arkansas hat.
[00:53:14] KK: Thank you. Does that go extra-large? Because I have a big, old melon head.
[00:53:17] KM: That's why you're so handsome. Have you ever noticed all handsome men have big heads? You two guys are handsome.
[00:53:24] GM: Thanks, mom.
[00:53:25] KM: Look, you got a little guitar pin to go with Johnny Cash.
[00:53:28] KK: Oh, I love that. Thank you.
[00:53:29] KM: That’s a guitar pin. Look, she gave you a bunch of stuff. Oh, look, a refrigerator magnet that says ‘Arkansas’, because you love Arkansas.
[00:53:37] KK: Well, I'm all –
[00:53:38] GM: Arkansas paraphernalia.
[00:53:39] KM: Boy, that is good. You got lot of stuff.
[00:53:40] KK: Thank you.
[00:53:41] KM: All right, we're going to end the show. Thank you for spending time with us. We hope you've heard, or learned something that's been inspiring, or enlightening. And that it, whatever it is, will help you up your business, your independent, or your life. I'm Kerry McCoy. And I'll see you next time on Up in Your Business. Until then, be brave and keep it up.
[OUTRO]
[00:53:59] GM: You've been listening to Up in Your Business with Kerry McCoy. If you'd like to sponsor this show, or any show, contact me, Gray at gray@flagandbanner.com. Kerry's goal is simple, to help you live the American dream.
[END]
